Constitutional Carry in Mississippi

[Deltamud77]

"Andy Gipson is a strong 2A leader, but he did not create Open Carry in MS. He changed the Concealed Carry law.. He simply changed the wording of "the firearm must be wholly or partially concealed" to "must be completely concealed" to match the opinion Jim Hood gave on what the Concealed Carry meant."

This is all true, but he authored the legislation and stuck his neck out of something that had HUGE implications at the time within this state to change that language. He had basically every municipality and law enforcement entity in the state angry at him for this clarifying language.

For the Mississippi Gun Rights group to call him anti-gun is crazy. They basically take the stance on all things political (if you look at their origins in Colorado) that they are the standard bearers for conservatism and gun rights...anything that disagrees with them makes you liberal and anti-gun.

That said, I am actually in favor of the constitutional carry in MS, but Mississippians need to understand that they will have to have a CC permit to travel and receive reciprocity with other states.

[1010]

Dudley brown is as far right as you can get, radical would be a better term! So to compared to brown Gipson is a sheep!

[cwink]

"Andy Gipson is a strong 2A leader, but he did not create Open Carry in MS. He changed the Concealed Carry law.. He simply changed the wording of "the firearm must be wholly or partially concealed" to "must be completely concealed" to match the opinion Jim Hood gave on what the Concealed Carry meant."

This is all true, but he authored the legislation and stuck his neck out of something that had HUGE implications at the time within this state to change that language. He had basically every municipality and law enforcement entity in the state angry at him for this clarifying language.

For the Mississippi Gun Rights group to call him anti-gun is crazy. They basically take the stance on all things political (if you look at their origins in Colorado) that they are the standard bearers for conservatism and gun rights...anything that disagrees with them makes you liberal and anti-gun.

That said, I am actually in favor of the constitutional carry in MS, but Mississippians need to understand that they will have to have a CC permit to travel and receive reciprocity with other states.

As an NRA Instructor and Enhanced Carry Instructor I teach this every class. I talked with Rep Gipson several times while the legislation was being proposed and was at the NRA Event honoring Rep Gibson for the completion of this legislation. Please understand this was never created or proposed as an OPEN CARRY BILL. This bill was created to help Concealed Carry permit holders in the event that their concealed carry firearm was inadvertently seen by the wind blowing up their coat or shirt flying up or some other event when a concealed carry gun was accidentally exposed.

After the NRA even with Rep Gipson, I talked with the NRA ILA representative for the South East and ask if they were going to help out the unintended consequences of this bill.

For example - Prior to this bill I could open carry anywhere I wanted to that was not regulated by the Concealed Carry Law. Or if I had a permit from the state and go into any place I wanted to with a concealed carry firearm that did not have a No Firearms Sign with out any issues or training at all.

The media billed this OPEN CARRY, and everyone freaked out and business put up "No Firearms" signs all over the place.

Now after the bill, I can still OPEN CARRY in any place not covered by the concealed carry law, but in order to go into the places that have since put up No Firearms signs I have to have a permit, I have to have the Enhanced Carry sticker (which requires training) and I am still facing possible trespassing charges if I carry a concealed firearm into a place of business that now has a no firearms signs.

There were a lot of unintended consequences to this bill. The gas station down the street, the tire shop, my doctor office and about 20 other places that I go every week never had a sign up before this bill passed. Now every time I go in there with my gun on I am possibly committing a misdemeanor.

Gipson is killing this latest bill and creating task force to study Constitutional carry to ensure we "don't have any more unintended consequences"

Rep Gipson is a great advocate for the 2A, but the bill you are referring to was not intended for OPEN CARRY.. We already had that. It was intended to help CC permit holders.

The only benefit of the law was that it transferred one gray area for Open Carry (definition of
"OPEN") to a gray area (Trespassing) for Concealed Carry.

[deltadukman]

This may strike a some people, but I am not opposed to constitutional carry for the most part. The people like me, and that I am around for the most part, and like the people I grew up with, know how to handle a gun better than the thugs they would probably be used against. Then there are the urban warriors who think if you arent dressed daily in "tacti cool" gear and have 50-11 classes and learnin under your belt, you dont deserve to carry. Then there are the thugs and DB's who will openly carry "just because you can". Im 50/50 on the deal but know for me, if I want to carry, I will. I carried a long time before there was such a big deal to having your ccw permit then I got it just to be safe.

[cwink]

This may strike a some people, but I am not opposed to constitutional carry for the most part. The people like me, and that I am around for the most part, and like the people I grew up with, know how to handle a gun better than the thugs they would probably be used against. Then there are the urban warriors who think if you arent dressed daily in "tacti cool" gear and have 50-11 classes and learnin under your belt, you dont deserve to carry. Then there are the thugs and DB's who will openly carry "just because you can". Im 50/50 on the deal but know for me, if I want to carry, I will. I carried a long time before there was such a big deal to having your ccw permit then I got it just to be safe.

Brett, you are correct most folks on this site will have more experience with firearm than the common thug. I too thought the whole permit personal protection thing was a scam. I grew up with a gun iny hand and shot competitively with handguns, rifles and shotguns. But when I became an instructor and attended more training classes and learned more I realized the average "country boy training" is completely different than tatical, multi assailant training. For example do you know how to do.a function check, the difference between a speed reload, tactical reload, and indexed reload? Can you clear a level 1,2 and 3 malfunction? Can you hit center mass or head shots, or perform a Mozambique or zipper technique at 3,5,7,10 and 15 yards?

The training I am talking about is not a carjacking or strong armed robbery deal. It's multiple determined assailants while under pressure. Or God forbid, a domestic enemy situation. The type of training I am talking about goes way beyond Law Enforcement or Military training. If you complete all of my courses you will have obtained a higher level of training than most police and military personnel.

[Deltamud77]

Please understand this was never created or proposed as an OPEN CARRY BILL. This bill was created to help Concealed Carry permit holders in the event that their concealed carry firearm was inadvertently seen by the wind blowing up their coat or shirt flying up or some other event when a concealed carry gun was accidentally exposed.

I guess that depends on who you talk to and when you talk to them.

I have heard very differently from the horse's mouth and the cowboy riding the horse...i.e., the NRA lobbyist for this region.

[cwink]

Please understand this was never created or proposed as an OPEN CARRY BILL. This bill was created to help Concealed Carry permit holders in the event that their concealed carry firearm was inadvertently seen by the wind blowing up their coat or shirt flying up or some other event when a concealed carry gun was accidentally exposed.

I guess that depends on who you talk to and when you talk to them.

I have heard very differently from the horse's mouth and the cowboy riding the horse...i.e., the NRA lobbyist for this region.

True. I have corresponded with Gipson before the bill passed and the NRA lobbyist after it past and after the NRA Freedom Award banquet for Gipson ( I was at that event). The problem with a lot of open carry bills (if they are called that or not, are intended to be open carry or not) is that it freaks out the non gun customers. Look at Starbucks, Chipotle, and Target that were mute on the issue until gun groups starting organizing Long gun or open carry events at the business. They started losing customers so the companies started putting up No Firearms signs. I understand they want to exercise their 2A rights, but they are effectively creating more Gun Free zones. Same thing happened here with the "Open Carry" law they passed.

We have to realize that sometimes we, the pro gun, pro 2A people shoot ourselves in the foot when we don't practice responsible gun ownership..If we let the wrong people get a hold of our guns or try to "show off" our guns..

It is almost impossible to always keep a long gun pointed in a safe direction while in a restaurant setting, or how would you like to be standing behind this guy in line to get a Latte with him wearing this shoulder holster???

[Deltamud77]

We have to realize that sometimes we, the pro gun, pro 2A people shoot ourselves in the foot when we don't practice responsible gun ownership..If we let the wrong people get a hold of our guns or try to "show off" our guns..

Completely agree. Zealotry in today's society is normally a bad thing - not always, but in many cases. If one is to be a complete zealot on a given issue, then they must also be willing to accept that there will be fallout for their position. They must also realize that is today's sensationalized society, the squeaky wheel gets the grease - meaning, those that are most obnoxious are the ones that will be deemed the de facto median for a given position, particularly if you are on the conservative or right side of a position.

These idiots in those pics don't represent the average gun owner - but the media will be happy to show them as though they do.

[1010]

Did Target put up no gun signs or just request that customers not bring there guns in the store.
And in GA, several folks were robbed in parking lots from this store request according to WND.
It's plenty of other chain stores that didn't follow Target. And not a surprise that target is not managed by anti-gun folks..
It's quite clear gun free zones doesn't work..

As for the shoulder holster, I have that very rig and consider it just as safe to others as any other holster that I have.
The trigger is covered from any possible operation by an object. It's plenty of others that must love it as well since its so popular from the reviews I've read.. I haven't read about folks dying from the rig either.

Those other pics,, well I don't agree with what they are doing,, BUT I understand,,
and I'm not going to throw the baby out with the bath water..

The 2nd is why we're here and why we'll be here tomorrow.

[cwink]

As for the shoulder holster, I have that very rig and consider it just as safe to others as any other holster that I have.
The trigger is covered from any possible operation by an object. It's plenty of others that must love it as well since its so popular from the reviews I've read.. I haven't read about folks dying from the rig either.

How would you feel standing behind someone that has a gun pointed directly at you??? I know of very few people that like looking down the barrel of a gun.. The draw from that holster on the other hand may not be safe.

The number one rule I have to get onto people for on the range is putting their finger inside the trigger guard as soon as they pick up the gun. Your finger should not touch that trigger until your sights are on target/threat. In that holster, without proper training of his/her index finger, would pull the gun from the holster, put finger in trigger guard, which would then be pointing at the person behind him/her, then he/she would pull the gun out from under his/her jacket sweep their left arm and all the people on their left side before finally addressing the threat that would most likely be in front of them.. No imagine doing all of this with a 1911 or other pistol that has a 3lb trigger on it. Oh and by the way, the gun owner has probably never practiced the draw so he/she doesn't know if they can clear the gun from under the coat without snagging the exposed hammer on something.

Many people never even fire their carry gun, and most never practice drawing from the holster.

The number one rule in gun safety is to ALWAYS keep the gun pointed in a safe direction. That is not possible with that holster. Many people also carry in their front pocket in a pocket holster.. I used to do that to, until I realized every time I sat down at a restaurant across the table from my family my gun was pointing directly at my wife or one of my sons..

No more.. It is either back pocket strong side or IWB or OWB strong side holster. This is the fastest and most direct draw to engage a threat I will not sweep myself, my family or others in this type of draw and it will keep the muzzle pointed down at all times..

[1010]

I can come up with all kinds of BS scenario's that would make any holster seem not safe from muzzle sweep or negligence discharge..
I seriously doubt folks are just going to be standing around behind me when somebody is committing a crime that would warrant me to pull out my weapon.

Before I even got that shoulder rig I could see what you are referring to. Anybody can.. And I make adjustments because of the angle of the weapon so unsuspecting people are not right behind me on that side.
Like I said folks are not dying from this shoulder rig, can you name one instance? How many instances can you name with IWB?
If a person places their finger on the trigger after its been removed it's not the holsters fault,, regardless of the holster. geezz..
And if they make the first mistake of placing their finger on the trigger from poor technique then muzzle sweep won't bother them either.

Women CC in their purse bothers me more than a shoulder rig.

[cwink]

Women CC in their purse bothers me more than a shoulder rig.

Me too.. I always tell them, if your going to cc in your purse, make sure it is a holster purse that has a dedicated pocket with a holster in it, and to choose a firearm that requires a double action only trigger pull. At least there is a very difficult trigger pull required to make it go off. And that the purse have reinforced straps so it can't be cut, and that they CAN NEVER take the purse off and leave it unattended. That is what happened to the lady in Walmart in Ohio who was killed by her 2 year old son. Then a few weeks ago a lady had a bra holster on and the gun went off and killed her in a dressing room of a store while she was changing.

A lot of people say guns just don't go off!!! But there are malfunctions and recalls with guns all the time.. We had a Rem 600 that went off in the deer stand about half the time when we closed the bold. Springfield, Rem, Smith & Wesson have all had recalls on their concealed carry guns recently. Did you hear about the gun going off in Pinelake Church? I know the guy, he came through one of my classes, and I told him just like I told all my classes to always use a holster. . Well his gun went off while it was in his front pocket. I talked to him right after it happened and he told me the gun had just come back from the manufacturer with a repair on the slide and the gun had a recall on the safety that the didn't fix. In addition, he watched the video of the gun going off with the police and he was sitting still, his hand was no where near the gun and there was nothing else in his pocket when the gun went off. What would have happened if that gun was pointing at the pew in front of him instead of down?

Guns do not normally just go off, but there are instances where they do. And people who normally wouldn't put their fingers inside a trigger guard before the sights are on target, forget this rule when they are under stress. I have seen it hundreds of times on the range. Perfect finger placement all day long. Then I make them run up to a table yell a command at a piece of paper while other students watch on and that little bit of pressure makes them forget all the basics....This happens to about 90% of the students I see on the range, lifelong sportsman, former military and police, new shooters, experienced shooters, it doesn't matter who it is.. I know you think I am being overly cautious and paranoid, but I have seen it too many times and all of these things have convinced me that the best holster options are the strong side hip or back pocket carry..

I have done some really dumb stuff with guns in the past, but I have just seen too many issues that I have come to the realization that I never want a loaded or unloaded gun to be pointed at me, and I sure don't want my loaded or unloaded gun to ever be pointed at a family member or anyone else for that matter..

[1010]

I'm going to admit something here, that is just my choice,, so spare me the lecture,, I've had the debate and read others debate it as well.
I don't carry with one in the pipe ever! So I carry a useless weapon to some. The striker fire weapons scare me plain and simple..
The first weapon I purchased was a 5906 with a UM leather vertical shoulder rig back in 1988. I wore this many miles on a horse, Hondas, and tractors. All day long and never was glad at the end of the day to take it off. This gun still looks new and is a safe queen and IMO is one of the safest weapons ever..

One other note I would never holster a striker weapon in my shoulder rig with out taking it off first and certainly never with one in the pipe.

Now I've got a G23 and a M&P9c with thumb safety, that are my go to guns. The IWB is miserable for me but I CC like this in the summer..
And I just can't bring my self to OWB carry except at the range..

[cwink]

I'm going to admit something here, that is just my choice,, so spare me the lecture,, I've had the debate and read others debate it as well.
I don't carry with one in the pipe ever! So I carry a useless weapon to some. The striker fire weapons scare me plain and simple..
The first weapon I purchased was a 5906 with a UM leather vertical shoulder rig back in 1988. I wore this many miles on a horse, Hondas, and tractors. All day long and never was glad at the end of the day to take it off. This gun still looks new and is a safe queen and IMO is one of the safest weapons ever..

One other note I would never holster a striker weapon in my shoulder rig with out taking it off first and certainly never with one in the pipe.

Now I've got a G23 and a M&P9c with thumb safety, that are my go to guns. The IWB is miserable for me but I CC like this in the summer..
And I just can't bring my self to OWB carry except at the range..

No lecture here. I used to not carry one in the pipe either.. But I now carry one in the pipe, with no safety and have no problem with it.. But I also train alot and have conditioned my trigger finger to only go into the trigger guard when I extend my firearm and to return to the frame when I return to retention ready.. It's just muscle memory and I don't have to think about it.. It's like tying your shoes in the dark.. Everyone can do it, because they practice tying their shoes.

5 minutes a week with dry fire drills at home is all it takes.. Draw, Trigger finger placement, load, unload, speed reload, clear malfunctions, function check, fields strip all can be down at home..

Or in your case.. Practice drawing and racking the slide if you choose not to carry one in the chamber..