New Wal-Mart logo

[stitch]

Chad, I have NO problem with Capitalism whatsoever. However, do you remember the stores Wal-Mart announced and built in China? Well, U.S. companies are required to have Chinese partners in order to do business in China. In order to avoid this Wal-Mart guaranteed China a minimum volume of products from China every year. Meaning, Wal-Mart then went to its suppliers and dictated that the suppliers must begin producing their products in China or Wal-Mart would cease to purchase them. It did not matter that it was actually cheaper to manufacture some of these goods in the U.S. Wal-Mart had to have them made in China. So, the price of some of these goods went up everywhere because the suppliers could not aford to operate two seperate manufacturing facilities and ended up moving all their production to China.

Now, like everything there is some good that comes from this, Wal-Mart is now importing certain items of produce (California Raisins for one) into China. However, the net effect of this deal has been a negative for U.S. manufacturing. In addition to the damage done through the loss of manufacturing the industrial growth in China has been a major contributor to the increased costs of raw materials for the goods manufactured or purchased here in the U.S. (particularly, steel, lead, and oil).

These are just a couple of reasons people choose to avoid doing business with Wal-Mart, but that tends to be kind of like avoiding driving on pavement...it is pretty much impossible if you want to get anywhere.

I am not a Wal-Mart "hater" but I choose not to support them if I have a choice but that is a personal decision for many reasons in addition to those listed above.

That's not WalMart's fault, that's the US govt's fault. All this crap that China is sending over is starting to catch up with them. I'm in the forest products business.....China put a hurt on the Hardwood plywood business for a few year, but quality and health concerns with their products....the market is about to come back after going to China for 3-4 years. Also, they killed the furniture production in the US......but it is slowly coming back. Again, I don't blame the Chinese, I blame the US govt. for allowing unfair trade practices......

[the doctor]

cant blame the govt stitch...those are the folks we elected plus they are heavily influenced by the same companies you are referring to...at the end of the day the manufacturers want ot be in China, at least for now

the doc

[DUCKAHOLIC]

Duckter you're right. But, many of those suppliers were told by Wal-Mart "either make it in China or we won't buy it from you" even if they could make it cheaper in the U.S. And because of the deal with the Chinese government some of these suppliers will not be able to leave China unless they want to quit selling to Wal-Mart. But, you're right that being made in China isn't as cheap as it once was.

Jeff, amen brother. That pretty much outlines the reason I avoid Wal-Mart outside of the foreign/domestic issue. Many of the products just are not good quality in my experience.

Show us some proof on that there Gordon...................................

We have Wal-Mart trucks come in here everyday, I go to Bentonville 2-3 times a year and meet with our department buyer.............I or we as a company have never been told what you preaching.


And if there are things that can be made cheaper in the US it is not very many.............

[GordonGekko]

Hmm...show you some proof....you've got me there, not much I can show you.... but I can hook you up with at least one president of a company that was told, not in so many words, years ago (ten years if memory serves) that they needed to find a "Chinese partner" to manufacture some of their products in order to continue their good relationship with Wal-Mart...the unofficial upshot at the time was that Wal-Mart had to guarantee a certain manufacturing volume would be sent to Chinese manufacturers in order to build there stores in China...the president made some phone calls and found out that he wasn't the only one being pressured.... In fact I believe you sent the fellow that was told that a few catalogs recently .....

These events took place in the past, and I imagine that Wal-Mart probably has no problem meeting the volume commitment they made (or such an agreement may be null and void now due to the great volume of products made in China).... However, these type of agreements aren't unusual for companies going into foreign markets, the governments want to ensure that their countries benefit too....

Now, I agree there are only a VERY few things that are more economical to produce domestically...and I don't have a problem at all with companies moving production to where it is most economical for them to produce...that is a fair market.... I am glad you guys have a great relationship with Wal-Mart...but I'd rather buy ya'lls stuff direct or through another venue if I can.... That is just my opinion...and I apologize if I came off as blasting Wal-Mart, that wasn't really my intent.... people can shop where they choose...I just choose not too if I can avoid it....

[DUCKAHOLIC]

I wouldnt say we have a great relationship they only have one sku (item) in their stores that is ours........you can not get in bed to deep with wal mart you will never survive.....they will take you to the top of the mountain and then kick your booty into bankrupcy.....then you will need a lawyer......and I dont even want to get into that discussion......

But yes we do sell them and yes we do shop there.......it is too convienant(SP) not to

[Unkljohn]

I really really hate to go to Wal-Mart. There are many reasons why. The tremedous purchasing power that they have is usually wielded like a massive hammer, often crushing their smaller suppliers in the process. We've all seen the 70+ year old guy there working to make ends meet, knowing full well that they are working him enough to make it worthwhile, but not enough for them to have to provide benefits. Not to mention it's usually full of screaming kids, and other people that are as pissed off as I am about being there...

[cwink]

I really really hate to go to Wal-Mart. There are many reasons why. The tremedous purchasing power that they have is usually wielded like a massive hammer, often crushing their smaller suppliers in the process. We've all seen the 70+ year old guy there working to make ends meet, knowing full well that they are working him enough to make it worthwhile, but not enough for them to have to provide benefits. Not to mention it's usually full of screaming kids, and other people that are as pissed off as I am about being there...

I wouldn't think a 70+ guy would need benefits.. We are already providing that for him thru Medicare. I think Walmart gives the Seniors something to do while earning a little extra money.. Not to many people would hire a 70+ year old.. So I kinda think that is one of the goods things about Walmart.

[Jeff]

Yes, a 70 year old gets medicare, but that only covers 80% of their medical bills after they have met their $500 deductible. So a senior in dire straits, may have medicare but still be on the short end of the stick. So some do still need the coverage and the $$ too bad it's from the evil place.

[donia]

The 70+ guy needs benefits b/c he hung on as long as he could and lost as much money as he could stand, but Wal-Mart still pushed him out of business - whether it be grocery store, hardware store, pharmacy, etc....

[stitch]

I don't believe the Chinese can make things cheaper, it's just their government subsidizing everything.....that's where I say it's not fair trade. Don't give me the cheap labor story either.....when you look at buying a Chinese product at half the cost of a domestic product, and labor is only 5% - 10% of the cost.....the math doesn't work out.

Again, my business has been hit hard by Chinese imports......as I study and learn more....look at the money in China....look at the banks in China.....look at what their govt. is doing with the money these hard working people and China are putting in the banks.....look at work forces shifting away from the industrial back to rural areas........dare I be as bold to say that you may see an implosion of China in the next 2-3 years.......will it be a situation similar to the former Soviet Union.....maybe.......will product then move to India, Korea, or Vietnam.....maybe.......but just keep your eye on China the next few years, they will go away for the most part. Remember who told you.....and can we make this thread a sticky?

[winston]

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[KillZone]

i believe they should improve their hunting section and actually hire some people that give a d@**