Kayakers and Canoers need some advise

[Blake Williamson]

I'm looking at buying one of the two for next yr. I'm just getting in this so I need some help from a experieced guy. I'm wanting to get something good. I'm looking at doing weekend trips. I want something good for fishing and have something that I can carry tent sleeping bag cooler all the things like that you would need for a whole weekend. Would you perfer a Canoe or Kayak? what kind?

Thanks
Blake

[dukhntn]

Well, you can get by with either. Canoe will obviously carry more gear, larger cooler, extra person, dog, etc... but you can also pack a weekend's (or a week's) worth of stuff in a kayak too. I've got both, but prefer my kayak because it's easier to paddle, can get in skinnier water, lighter, etc... I've found over years of canoe-camping that I almost always bring more crap than is needed, and that no matter if I'm in my canoe or my kayak it's going to be loaded down.

Will you be mostly paddling by yourself (in the boat by yourself), or will you have someone with you? Choose the canoe if paddling tandem. You can get a tandem kayak, but then you've got twice the people (and gear) and not as much room to pack stuff.

You said weekend trips. Will they be more on lakes? Streams, creeks, rivers?

If you are accustomed to carrying a lot of stuff food-wise (cooler full of beer, steaks, dutch-oven, cast iron pot, etc...) You'd probably be better served by a canoe. If you don't plan on all that and would rather carry a bottle of whiskey, can of beans, etc... then a kayak would be fine.

Once you decide canoe or kayak, then you've still got some decisions to make. Length, material, model, etc...


I've got 3 different kayaks and a couple of canoes. You are welcome to come try them out sometime.

[free78]

What dukhntn said. He pretty much covered it all. I have both myself. It just depends what I'm doing and where I'm going on which one I use. If you can go try out dukhntn's like he offered, that will give you a good idea of what you would like.

[Blake Williamson]

Well, you can get by with either. Canoe will obviously carry more gear, larger cooler, extra person, dog, etc... but you can also pack a weekend's (or a week's) worth of stuff in a kayak too. I've got both, but prefer my kayak because it's easier to paddle, can get in skinnier water, lighter, etc... I've found over years of canoe-camping that I almost always bring more crap than is needed, and that no matter if I'm in my canoe or my kayak it's going to be loaded down.

Will you be mostly paddling by yourself (in the boat by yourself), or will you have someone with you? Choose the canoe if paddling tandem. You can get a tandem kayak, but then you've got twice the people (and gear) and not as much room to pack stuff.

You said weekend trips. Will they be more on lakes? Streams, creeks, rivers?

If you are accustomed to carrying a lot of stuff food-wise (cooler full of beer, steaks, dutch-oven, cast iron pot, etc...) You'd probably be better served by a canoe. If you don't plan on all that and would rather carry a bottle of whiskey, can of beans, etc... then a kayak would be fine.

Once you decide canoe or kayak, then you've still got some decisions to make. Length, material, model, etc...


I've got 3 different kayaks and a couple of canoes. You are welcome to come try them out sometime.

Thanks man!!

I'm mostly going to be on the rivers. And for the most part I guess it's just going to be me and the dog. I got a Yeti 50qt cooler to do along with a 25qt. I've got a Dutch oven and one of the cast iron lodge grills to. So I'm thinking a canoe would probably best suit me. Especially with the dog in the boat. That would give him more room anyway. Do the longer canoes paddle easier or should I look at a shorter one? What about the with do they have some wider then others?

[dukhntn]

The canoe I've got is 17ft and has worked well for me over the years. If you've narrowed it down to a canoe now you've got to decide between materials, length, etc... I've always liked aluminum, but there are other good materials out there. I'm not all that knowledgeable on canoes, but greenheadgrimreaper seems to be. Maybe you can get him to chime in on this thread. Until then see this: http://www.ducksouth.com/phpbb/viewtopi ... oe#p879406

Use searchtempest.com to look for a used on (if you plan on going that route). Or, just keep your eyes open as you ride backroads. When you see a canoe at someone's house, barn, shed, etc... stop and ask if it is for sale. I've bought a lot of stuff (and one of my canoes) like this over the years.

[greenheadgrimreaper]

If I can't get into skinny water with my canoe then it's too damn skinny for me to be in it. I am a purist when it comes to float camping, so I admit my bias. With that being said, for a weekend float trip you cannot beat a canoe. Canoes are the outdoorsman's boat in my opinion. Chicks dig em too. Blake you see all these hoes I'm pimpin'? It's the canoe.

If I am guessing I am saying you're using it on the Pearl and various other rivers. You may use it for duck hunting, you will have that heavy booty yeti in it and other stuff? If you're dragging one over logs, throwing it on a trailer, and just all around using it like it's supposed to be used then I'd go with royalex material.

We are going float camping first weekend of November. When we go we have the staples: whiskey, summer sausage, crackers and some raman noodles. We usually don't have a tent, but when we take one it doesn't contribute much weight. In short we usually camp ultralight. But the beauty of float tripping rivers is as long as you aren't dangerously overloaded you can pack a lot more stuff than you can when your hiking.

Also, I wouldn't worry too much about how a canoe paddles, speed-wise, if you're mainly floating rivers. I would go with a keel-less model made of royalex in the 15 to 17 foot range. Get one with a little rocker to it for more maneuverability. One with a little more tumblehome for quieter paddling and for pulling those monster nagger fish called bass that ya'll fish for over the side. Carrying capacity is something to pay attention to. Also get one with good secondary stability. If you're not racing canoes on flatwater there is no reason to NOT have a canoe that is stable.

[Marenisco]

For what you describe, a canoe is a great option. I'm not up on brand names, but get one thats stable and durable. Unless you plan on portaging it, aluminum is what I would recommend. I've had mine for almost 50 years and other than replacing the seat webbing, I haven't had any problem. Look for one thats wider in the beam and has low slung seats. The lower the seats, the more stable the canoe. Ditto with the beam width. If you plan on going solo alot, you can get/make a removeable seat so you sit closer to the middle when you're by yourself. That'll give you better control and less problem with wind catching the bow. For what its worth mine is a Chestnut brand but I'm not sure they make them anymore.

[Blake Williamson]

If I can't get into skinny water with my canoe then it's too damn skinny for me to be in it. I am a purist when it comes to float camping, so I admit my bias. With that being said, for a weekend float trip you cannot beat a canoe. Canoes are the outdoorsman's boat in my opinion. Chicks dig em too. Blake you see all these hoes I'm pimpin'? It's the canoe.

If I am guessing I am saying you're using it on the Pearl and various other rivers. You may use it for duck hunting, you will have that heavy booty yeti in it and other stuff? If you're dragging one over logs, throwing it on a trailer, and just all around using it like it's supposed to be used then I'd go with royalex material.

We are going float camping first weekend of November. When we go we have the staples: whiskey, summer sausage, crackers and some raman noodles. We usually don't have a tent, but when we take one it doesn't contribute much weight. In short we usually camp ultralight. But the beauty of float tripping rivers is as long as you aren't dangerously overloaded you can pack a lot more stuff than you can when your hiking.

Also, I wouldn't worry too much about how a canoe paddles, speed-wise, if you're mainly floating rivers. I would go with a keel-less model made of royalex in the 15 to 17 foot range. Get one with a little rocker to it for more maneuverability. One with a little more tumblehome for quieter paddling and for pulling those monster nagger fish called bass that ya'll fish for over the side. Carrying capacity is something to pay attention to. Also get one with good secondary stability. If you're not racing canoes on flatwater there is no reason to NOT have a canoe that is stable.

I hear ya pimpster!!! LOL

Yeah I'm looking for something for the Pearl and Big Black River. I may even try the Nox out a time or two. Didn't you get a Old Town Austin? I was looking at one of thiers.

[free78]

For what you are planning Dicks, Academy, Bass Pro all have some decent ones at a decent price. I think around $500 last time I looked. I have a 15ft flat back with a 8 merc. It's about 47 1/2" wide in the middle on either side of middle seat/live well. Mine is fiberglass but I don't plan on whitewater rafting or busting thru ice with it. Canoeing/Kayaking has gotten real popular lately and there is a ton of different ones to choose from. Check out some of the outfitters around rivers and creeks, the ones around me always have good deals on used ones.

[dukhntn]

For what you are planning Dicks, Academy, Bass Pro all have some decent ones at a decent price. I think around $500 last time I looked. I have a 15ft flat back with a 8 merc. It's about 47 1/2" wide in the middle on either side of middle seat/live well. Mine is fiberglass but I don't plan on whitewater rafting or busting thru ice with it. Canoeing/Kayaking has gotten real popular lately and there is a ton of different ones to choose from. Check out some of the outfitters around rivers and creeks, the ones around me always have good deals on used ones.

From what I have seen (and I haven't checked recently) the outfitters down around Seminary sell their canoes for around $300. They are aluminum, around 14-16ft if I remember correctly, and are usually beat up pretty good.

[ScottBrown]

GHGR is right about the royalex canoes. They are the most stable and better to drag hands down. Whatever you do dont put a 50 quart yeti in a canoe when you will be in skinny water or will have to drag it or paddle it or any type of movement what so ever..Defeats the whole purpose of a light weight maneuverable boat. The scanoe is nice especially when you are paddling alone.

[Blake Williamson]

For what you are planning Dicks, Academy, Bass Pro all have some decent ones at a decent price. I think around $500 last time I looked. I have a 15ft flat back with a 8 merc. It's about 47 1/2" wide in the middle on either side of middle seat/live well. Mine is fiberglass but I don't plan on whitewater rafting or busting thru ice with it. Canoeing/Kayaking has gotten real popular lately and there is a ton of different ones to choose from. Check out some of the outfitters around rivers and creeks, the ones around me always have good deals on used ones.

From what I have seen (and I haven't checked recently) the outfitters down around Seminary sell their canoes for around $300. They are aluminum, around 14-16ft if I remember correctly, and are usually beat up pretty good.

The aluminum ones are them ole drummin canoe's aren't they? I got a buddy that has one. It's pretty good little canoes. It's just long as heck I think its a 16ft.

I've looked at the ones at Dick's. Is the Old Town with the coolers built in worth anything?

[dukhntn]

Never heard of drummin (are you meaning Grumman?)

I don't have any experience with them, but as a matter of personal taste I would stay away from them. I wouldn't want something with a built in cooler that takes up storage space. Also the way you load your canoe will change depending on if you are paddling solo or tandem. I want the option of being able to move my heavier gear (cooler) to redistribute weight as needed.

[Blake Williamson]

Never heard of drummin (are you meaning Grumman?)

I don't have any experience with them, but as a matter of personal taste I would stay away from them. I wouldn't want something with a built in cooler that takes up storage space. Also the way you load your canoe will change depending on if you are paddling solo or tandem. I want the option of being able to move my heavier gear (cooler) to redistribute weight as needed.

Yeah Grumman thats it. Do they still make them at all?

Gotcha.... Yeah I see where you coming from on that.

[dukhntn]

http://www.marathonboat.com/grummancanoes.asp
And for what it's worth, 17' Grumman canoe's are what the Okatoma Outpost canoe rental place uses.

Occasionally aluminum canoes will pop up on craigslist around here, but they are few and far between. There was a guy in Flora a couple of months back that had 2 aluminum canoes, a trailer that carried both, 4 paddles, 4 life vests, and 4 chair back canoe seats for $600, but I think he sold them. Canoes just aren't as big a deal down here as they are up north (NY, MN, WI, etc...)