change.

[quackheadbp]

i hate wading in to this, b/c it's not gonna matter. no one's minds are gonna be changed, particularly at the level it has to be. it will also come off as "i told you so".......considering that, let me get it out of the way, I TOLD YOU SO......again, and again, AND AGAIN.

in a time when hunters rights (and sportsmen's rights alike) are becoming ever more increasingly taken away, hindered, restricted, etc etc, i find it strange, curious and not the least bit sad that the apathy a few show toward this issue. often the "haves" shrug their collective shoulders at the "have nots" (read, public hunters may or may not be able to afford their own land to lease/own) and say basically "i don't hunt there, get over it".

i'm convinced the argument is too late, but here goes.....again.

do we really REALLY want to say we live in a state where the only available way to hunt land THAT WE PAY FOR as a citizen to be dictated via "being lucky"? joe/mudsucker said it best when he stated it'd be nice to be able to KNOW the few days he gets to hunt, he GETS TO HUNT.

now, looking deeper...what are some of the by products of draws? is it better hunting, both in numbers and quality??? if you think, for one second, it's gonna bring numbers to an area...please, go take a cold shower and have a stiff drink, or at the very least, go make your wife miserable and bow out of this. so far as "better quality" - maybe, but just as like maybe not. as i move through life, i have come to realize you can't legislate stupid.....you can't keep it out, you can't stop it. stupid WILL find you.

you're just as likely to prohibit the 30 yr salt that'd just as soon hunt by himself w/ his dog, totes a few decoys in and had rather shoot 4 in the lips w/ their feet down as 6 over the trees, than you are to exclude the idiot w/ the spinner, a belt of ammo, and a breaking dog he hollars at the whole time. eventually, STUPID WILL FIND YOU.

so, then, we get the draw.....let's just randomly pic a number - say 20 spots for simplicity. 50 hunters show up that day. let's get out of thinking "4 to a group", let's make the argument simple. so, that's 30 folks that at 5 a.m. do NOT HAVE A SPOT. where will they go???? answer - a tree near you........right at shooting time. i've been hunting in Misery at these fabled "parks", and and you didn't go to teh draw w/out a boat for the river and directions to the next area closest. ya'll want to see lease prices go up further? watch the land that surrounds these areas. it may not be next year, or 5 years, but eventually, it is gonna happen.

thus, you've lost public ground and indirectly, you get outbid on lease ground....what are you going to do then? honestly, i don't know either.

these are but a few - i'm at work, you'll forgive me if i don't feel like getting too involved AGAIN.

somebody mentioned those concerned should basically stop whining and come up w/ solutions....my question is, why am i constantly having to do someone else' job? my solution would be to clean house of everyone up at that office, starting at the TOP. but, b/c i can think of some that may help, i'll try.

there are many MANY areas that should total eliminate ATV traffic. i can think of a few right now nearby. you take them away, you decrease noise, ease at which it affords those from getting in on you, and the destruction of already unstable environments. limit shells to 15 (and, at least periodically, get out of your truck and enforce it). doesn't make much sense to sky bust at birds you know in the back of your head, you can't hit anyhow. again, stupid people will try, and by simple enforcement efforts, you'll eventually get to them.

i look at public ground as basically a lease....a BIG lease. i'm a citizen, i pay taxes, etc, so directly and indirectly i'm paying for it's use. increase the cost of utilizing said public ground across the board. get congress on it (they like playing law officers and scientist anyway) and pass a bill that funnels ALL of this money to the department for upgrades and improvements. and, i'm not talking about 5 bucks....i'm talking real money. and, if it can't operate under that influx, well, it's called a budget, you missed it, you're fired.

and, lastly, a percentage of this new money should be set aside to BUY POLLES OUT. a one time check, paid for by the sportsmen of mississippi that both live here and use it's land, who's only stipulation is he LEAVE OFFICE.

this ain't misery or kalifornia, and quite frankly, we're just better than them...wouldn't it be nice for someone to be there that thought the same?

-justin

well said

[LawDawg]

i hate wading in to this, b/c it's not gonna matter. no one's minds are gonna be changed, particularly at the level it has to be. it will also come off as "i told you so".......considering that, let me get it out of the way, I TOLD YOU SO......again, and again, AND AGAIN.

in a time when hunters rights (and sportsmen's rights alike) are becoming ever more increasingly taken away, hindered, restricted, etc etc, i find it strange, curious and not the least bit sad that the apathy a few show toward this issue. often the "haves" shrug their collective shoulders at the "have nots" (read, public hunters may or may not be able to afford their own land to lease/own) and say basically "i don't hunt there, get over it".

i'm convinced the argument is too late, but here goes.....again.

do we really REALLY want to say we live in a state where the only available way to hunt land THAT WE PAY FOR as a citizen to be dictated via "being lucky"? joe/mudsucker said it best when he stated it'd be nice to be able to KNOW the few days he gets to hunt, he GETS TO HUNT.

now, looking deeper...what are some of the by products of draws? is it better hunting, both in numbers and quality??? if you think, for one second, it's gonna bring numbers to an area...please, go take a cold shower and have a stiff drink, or at the very least, go make your wife miserable and bow out of this. so far as "better quality" - maybe, but just as like maybe not. as i move through life, i have come to realize you can't legislate stupid.....you can't keep it out, you can't stop it. stupid WILL find you.

you're just as likely to prohibit the 30 yr salt that'd just as soon hunt by himself w/ his dog, totes a few decoys in and had rather shoot 4 in the lips w/ their feet down as 6 over the trees, than you are to exclude the idiot w/ the spinner, a belt of ammo, and a breaking dog he hollars at the whole time. eventually, STUPID WILL FIND YOU.

so, then, we get the draw.....let's just randomly pic a number - say 20 spots for simplicity. 50 hunters show up that day. let's get out of thinking "4 to a group", let's make the argument simple. so, that's 30 folks that at 5 a.m. do NOT HAVE A SPOT. where will they go???? answer - a tree near you........right at shooting time. i've been hunting in Misery at these fabled "parks", and and you didn't go to teh draw w/out a boat for the river and directions to the next area closest. ya'll want to see lease prices go up further? watch the land that surrounds these areas. it may not be next year, or 5 years, but eventually, it is gonna happen.

thus, you've lost public ground and indirectly, you get outbid on lease ground....what are you going to do then? honestly, i don't know either.

these are but a few - i'm at work, you'll forgive me if i don't feel like getting too involved AGAIN.

somebody mentioned those concerned should basically stop whining and come up w/ solutions....my question is, why am i constantly having to do someone else' job? my solution would be to clean house of everyone up at that office, starting at the TOP. but, b/c i can think of some that may help, i'll try.

there are many MANY areas that should total eliminate ATV traffic. i can think of a few right now nearby. you take them away, you decrease noise, ease at which it affords those from getting in on you, and the destruction of already unstable environments. limit shells to 15 (and, at least periodically, get out of your truck and enforce it). doesn't make much sense to sky bust at birds you know in the back of your head, you can't hit anyhow. again, stupid people will try, and by simple enforcement efforts, you'll eventually get to them.

i look at public ground as basically a lease....a BIG lease. i'm a citizen, i pay taxes, etc, so directly and indirectly i'm paying for it's use. increase the cost of utilizing said public ground across the board. get congress on it (they like playing law officers and scientist anyway) and pass a bill that funnels ALL of this money to the department for upgrades and improvements. and, i'm not talking about 5 bucks....i'm talking real money. and, if it can't operate under that influx, well, it's called a budget, you missed it, you're fired.

and, lastly, a percentage of this new money should be set aside to BUY POLLES OUT. a one time check, paid for by the sportsmen of mississippi that both live here and use it's land, who's only stipulation is he LEAVE OFFICE.

this ain't misery or kalifornia, and quite frankly, we're just better than them...wouldn't it be nice for someone to be there that thought the same?

-justin

Justin, you hit it right on the head when you mentioned that their argument is that going to a draw would increase the quality of hunting. I have talked to several people in the gubment about this issue (archery hunters just lost a hard fought battle this year, but that's another topic for another day), and they REALLY think that going to a draw will mean that everyone drawn will have better hunts. why? because they get good reports of birds killed up north that have draw systems.

does it cross their mind that being north has anything to do with the number of ducks killed? apparently not, because when I mention it, i get about 3 seconds of silence.

I kidded above, but it was out of frustration for all these new changes. I honestly don't know how to change anything about this. write your representatives, call this person, email this person, blah blah blah. NONE of that is making a difference. I'm beginning to think that one person makes the decision and it doesn't matter what the populous wants.

It's a bit frustrating to say the least. I am definitely a "have not" that has been public land hunting for over 20 years and well, if this starts applying to my favorite public land spots, I might be playing cat and mouse with the law. Wait until I get 4 greenheads on the water, shoot once and get the #$%^ out of dodge.

[BR549]

[quote="gator"]i hate wading in to this, b/c it's not gonna matter. no one's minds are gonna be changed, particularly at the level it has to be. it will also come off as "i told you so".......considering that, let me get it out of the way, I TOLD YOU SO......again, and again, AND AGAIN.

in a time when hunters rights (and sportsmen's rights alike) are becoming ever more increasingly taken away, hindered, restricted, etc etc, i find it strange, curious and not the least bit sad that the apathy a few show toward this issue. often the "haves" shrug their collective shoulders at the "have nots" (read, public hunters may or may not be able to afford their own land to lease/own) and say basically "i don't hunt there, get over it".


do we really REALLY want to say we live in a state where the only available way to hunt land THAT WE PAY FOR as a citizen to be dictated via "being lucky"?

now, looking deeper...what are some of the by products of draws? is it better hunting, both in numbers and quality??? if you think, for one second, it's gonna bring numbers to an area...please, go take a cold shower and have a stiff drink, or at the very least, go make your wife miserable and bow out of this. so far as "better quality" - maybe, but just as like maybe not. as i move through life, i have come to realize you can't legislate stupid.....you can't keep it out, you can't stop it. stupid WILL find you.

you're just as likely to prohibit the 30 yr salt that'd just as soon hunt by himself w/ his dog, totes a few decoys in and had rather shoot 4 in the lips w/ their feet down as 6 over the trees, than you are to exclude the idiot w/ the spinner, a belt of ammo, and a breaking dog he hollars at the whole time. eventually, STUPID WILL FIND YOU.

so, then, we get the draw.....let's just randomly pic a number - say 20 spots for simplicity. 50 hunters show up that day. let's get out of thinking "4 to a group", let's make the argument simple. so, that's 30 folks that at 5 a.m. do NOT HAVE A SPOT. where will they go???? answer - a tree near you........right at shooting time. i've been hunting in Misery at these fabled "parks", and and you didn't go to teh draw w/out a boat for the river and directions to the next area closest. ya'll want to see lease prices go up further? watch the land that surrounds these areas. it may not be next year, or 5 years, but eventually, it is gonna happen.

thus, you've lost public ground and indirectly, you get outbid on lease ground....what are you going to do then? honestly, i don't know either.

somebody mentioned those concerned should basically stop whining and come up w/ solutions....my question is, why am i constantly having to do someone else' job? my solution would be to clean house of everyone up at that office, starting at the TOP. but, b/c i can think of some that may help, i'll try.

there are many MANY areas that should total eliminate ATV traffic. i can think of a few right now nearby. you take them away, you decrease noise, ease at which it affords those from getting in on you, and the destruction of already unstable environments. limit shells to 15 (and, at least periodically, get out of your truck and enforce it). doesn't make much sense to sky bust at birds you know in the back of your head, you can't hit anyhow. again, stupid people will try, and by simple enforcement efforts, you'll eventually get to them.

i look at public ground as basically a lease....a BIG lease. i'm a citizen, i pay taxes, etc, so directly and indirectly i'm paying for it's use. increase the cost of utilizing said public ground across the board. get congress on it (they like playing law officers and scientist anyway) and pass a bill that funnels ALL of this money to the department for upgrades and improvements. and, i'm not talking about 5 bucks....i'm talking real money. and, if it can't operate under that influx, well, it's called a budget, you missed it, you're fired.

and, lastly, a percentage of this new money should be set aside to BUY POLLES OUT. a one time check, paid for by the sportsmen of mississippi that both live here and use it's land, who's only stipulation is he LEAVE OFFICE.


Gator, I ask you this? When did hunting and fishing become a right in this state? It is a priviledge and always has been. Now John Q. Public is abusing his priviledge thus leading to all the regulations! The very same priviledges that our Dept of Wildlife allows us to enjoy! Also the last time I looked the director of the dept of wildlife was not an elected official but appointed! He's been thru more than one Governor too so obviously more than one person thought he was qualified for the job! Lastly, have you ever served on the wildlife commision? Had to deal with all the headaches, bitchin, crying and whinning that goes on over there? Till you do, and untill the law changes and says we have a right to hunt then you best just be satisfied with the PRIVILEDGE THESE PEOPLE JUST SO HAPPEN TO ALLOW YOU TO ENJOY!

[gator]

BR, i'm NOT gonna argue w/ you. i'm just not. privilege, right, whatever and however you want to spin it, that's fine by me. the fact is, it's there, i pay for it to some extent, so i'll hope you allow me to form, have, and speak my own opinion if i should so choose.

agreed?

thanks, and sincerely, justin harrison

[jacksbuddy]

there are many MANY areas that should total eliminate ATV traffic. i can think of a few right now nearby. you take them away, you decrease noise, ease at which it affords those from getting in on you, and the destruction of already unstable environments. limit shells to 15 (and, at least periodically, get out of your truck and enforce it). doesn't make much sense to sky bust at birds you know in the back of your head, you can't hit anyhow. again, stupid people will try, and by simple enforcement efforts, you'll eventually get to them.

When last we discussed this very topic a year or so ago, our friend gator made this same argument -albeit a bit more eloquently then, but just as effectively. And when I read this thread, I thought about that post.

In my first post to this thread, I mentioned that griping about it won't solve the problem. That we need to come up with a real plan of action for an alternative to this draw situation. And after all of the griping, balling, name calling, and hot-headedness that this thread has elicited, it appears that Mr. Gator has summed up this solution simply and effectively -

1) Ban all ATVs from Public Lands. If you want to hunt, then hunt. If you want to ride your 4 wheeler all day, then go to a dirt track. Either way, this will dramatically affect the number of people crowding public lands because people who have more money than sense won't be there.
2) Limit the number of shells allowed into public lands. This'll limit the pressure on wildlife - both human AND foul . It will also encourage sportsmanship and conservation because nobody wants to be out of shells when the ducks are flying.
3) Establish a 'No-Wake' rule at the ramp. This is simply safer, a no-brainer.
4) Enforce the law. - Be it boat safety (if your boat can only carry 4 people, don't have 5 people, a dog, 300 decoys, 8 spinners, etc.), hunter safety (licenses, stamps, etc.), littering, or anything else.

Sounds like a good idea to me. And if I over-translated Mr. Gator's idea - - - - - oops.

Now, who wants to get this information to someone who can made a difference?

[deltadukman]

BR549.....thats like saying that I have never served in Congress or on the Senate so I shouldnt pass judgement on that moron in the Whitehouse and his manifesto to give the n!ggers free healthcare....just because i've never heard their bitching. Just saying, the MDWPF is a joke of an agency. I have alot of first hand knowledge that comes from people who work and have worked for Polles. I am friends with his son, and often eat lunch with him at the Neshoba County Fair, but they are basterdising our state resources for financial gain...any way they can. Yall remember when Oakley sunglass stickers were the "cool thing to do" instead of duck hunting. I do. Every swinging d!ck douche bag that wants to flex his muscles is becoming a hunter. I have watched the progression of the hunter ever since I was a little kid. Now that we have the internet and facebook I am seeing people who I never would have thought would have taken their Maxima's off of the mall parking lot...buying 4wd drive trucks with chrome rims and 20" mud tires and plastering stickers all over it and posting his grab and grin pictures on his facebook profile to show all the world that country is cool and he's a duck hunter now g'dammit. Now I know that sounds like I am sterotyping...and I am, but its this mindset that "The Department" embelished and thought that they could cash in on the "duck hunting is cool craze". Notice there wasn't much emphasis put on duck hunting WMA's and management until the last few years. Just look at how they dont try and enforce all the hands catching 50-11 crappie on our "crappie highway" catching them, putting them in a deep freezer, and hauling them back to MO to sell, and raping out resources... did the department try to stop this activity...no...they just made it tough on everybody...not just the douchebags(and I use that term to describe people from out of state who come over here and pillage our resources and dont give a flying fluck about the repercussions). If I want to hunt, then dammit im gonna hunt. That whole operation up there off of Ridgewood needs a complete overhaul. Dont tell me that the only reason they bumped the rifle season into the last few great weekends of bow season was to give more people the oportunity to harvest does. Thats bullshat and they know it. It was $$$$ driven. Before long, your not going to have to work for it and people are going to be able to just pull up to Ridgewood Road at the HQ, and take a grab and grin picture of 50-11 mallards and a 300" deer and be on their way. This spoonfeeding the people who screw everything up and dont have a clue what they are doing has got to stop.

[Trip]

It will be a sad day for us all when all of the state WMA's are draw only, to think otherwise is just frying stupid! The shear mention of this makes my skin crawl.

Lodi, you're welcome to come hunt w/ us in Ark. I will warn you though, there may be other duck hunters in the woods b/c the state of Ar hasn't deemed it necessary to say who can go hunt a particular block of woods on which day.

[BR549]

BR549.....thats like saying that I have never served in Congress or on the Senate so I shouldnt pass judgement on that moron in the Whitehouse and his manifesto to give the n!ggers free healthcare....just because i've never heard their bitching. Just saying, the MDWPF is a joke of an agency. I have alot of first hand knowledge that comes from people who work and have worked for Polles. I am friends with his son, and often eat lunch with him at the Neshoba County Fair, but they are basterdising our state resources for financial gain...any way they can. Yall remember when Oakley sunglass stickers were the "cool thing to do" instead of duck hunting. I do. Every swinging d!ck douche bag that wants to flex his muscles is becoming a hunter. I have watched the progression of the hunter ever since I was a little kid. Now that we have the internet and facebook I am seeing people who I never would have thought would have taken their Maxima's off of the mall parking lot...buying 4wd drive trucks with chrome rims and 20" mud tires and plastering stickers all over it and posting his grab and grin pictures on his facebook profile to show all the world that country is cool and he's a duck hunter now g'dammit. Now I know that sounds like I am sterotyping...and I am, but its this mindset that "The Department" embelished and thought that they could cash in on the "duck hunting is cool craze". Notice there wasn't much emphasis put on duck hunting WMA's and management until the last few years. Just look at how they dont try and enforce all the hands catching 50-11 crappie on our "crappie highway" catching them, putting them in a deep freezer, and hauling them back to MO to sell, and raping out resources... did the department try to stop this activity...no...they just made it tough on everybody...not just the douchebags(and I use that term to describe people from out of state who come over here and pillage our resources and dont give a flying fluck about the repercussions). If I want to hunt, then dammit im gonna hunt. That whole operation up there off of Ridgewood needs a complete overhaul. Dont tell me that the only reason they bumped the rifle season into the last few great weekends of bow season was to give more people the oportunity to harvest does. Thats bullshat and they know it. It was $$$$ driven. Before long, your not going to have to work for it and people are going to be able to just pull up to Ridgewood Road at the HQ, and take a grab and grin picture of 50-11 mallards and a 300" deer and be on their way. This spoonfeeding the people who screw everything up and dont have a clue what they are doing has got to stop.

Then you better start with your elected officials then. I will say this though. If you think you can do a better job then have you a go at it before you critisize those that are trying! It's not quite what you think up there! The dept of wildlife happens to be one of the only self supporting forms of govt If not the only one we have in the state of MS. I say again John Q Public brought all this on yourselfs! The state of MS owes you nothing! They are trying to give you as much resources and places to hunt as posssible. If everyone would just quit screwing up and use a little common sense and courtesy a lot of this bullshiatt would go away. But untill that day come there will be more and more regulations and you will loose more and more of your priviledges at WMA'S. That just the way it is! What other choices do they have ? That "They owe me crap" attitude is the problem!

[Seymore]

The state "owes" nothing to an individual. The state owes the public at large to provide the maximum return for the resource to the most people it can. If this upsets some apple carts that's just to bad. If some of the crap that has gone on in the past had not happened and hunters policed themselves better then maybe we wouldn't be here.

I don't like the idea of draws any better than the rest of you. However, what other choice is there? The current rules and regulations are being ignored so saying, "Let's just enforce what we have" isn't going to get it.

[DUCK-HUNT]

a percentage of this new money should be set aside to BUY POLLES OUT. a one time check, paid for by the sportsmen of mississippi that both live here and use it's land, who's only stipulation is he LEAVE OFFICE.

100% correct nothing is going to get better till he is gone.... all he has ever been worried about is padding his pocket.... he could give 2 dumps about the resources OR the people of this state.....

well said Gator well said.....


and Seymore the current regulations are being ignored because no one is enforcing them but more regulation is gonna make it better.... come on guy you have to smarter than a 5th grader... If the police sat in their office all day playing on internet and never wrote any tickets you think anyone would follow the speed limit?????? NOPE..... but hey lets drop the speed limit to 15 and that will fix the problem..... sheeeeeeez people WAKE UP!!!!

[bigwater]

their was a time when hunting wasn't a privilge but a necessity!

[Scully]

Torches and pitchforks for sale- see Uncle Scully.....by the way- I agree

[Denduke]

Impeach Sam Polles!!!
Pre season draw is a joke ereybody can see that. None of'em show up. The reality of the present draws is stand bys. Enforce the safety rules, shell limits, ATV restrictions, no-wake. The partitioning of the areas to keep groups apart is one good point that has come from the present draw deal. Plenty of ways to get the most out of the WMAs that could be worked out. $.02

[booger]

Sad sad state of affairs. Each year I've been doing more and more out of state hunting on non draw public land.

I think the draw is what the state decides when they give up. It's just a lazy answer to a problem that doesn't exist. However, I will concede that on reclaimed man made catfish ponds there may be no other options than to dole out locations.

A "no wake" zone is laughable though. Just another unenforceable silly rule.

I think there are just too many puzzies out in the woods.

[davidees]

I hunt public land and I never have problems with overcrowding. In fact, most days on this particular WMA, I dont even see another duck hunter. I spend a LOT of time scouting to find these places. However, my concern is like Lodi says, its a domino effect. In the next few years the place I hunt will be ruined because of too many hunters who have nowhere else to go. I could care less about the Scatters, but I understand how it will potentially affect me. Its BS.